A Conversation With A Gay Man Regarding Same-Sex Relationships

From time to time, I have conversations with persons who advocate for same-sex relationships. In every case I find that these persons are not really aware of what the Bible states regarding these relationships, nor what Jesus said and has done concerning same-sex relationships.

The following dialogue is from my comments and exchanges with a gay man who responded to the first comment I made at the Federalist, on February 15, 2020:

Robert Clifton Robinson: “The term: “homophobic,” is a misnomer. Used incessantly in application to nearly anyone who opposes the behavior of gay persons, this term is inaccurate. Christians are not homophobic, nor do we hate same-sex persons. We know that persons who live in this manner, harm themselves and degrade human society. We do not fear same-sex persons, only the harm they cause by their demands and manner of living.”

Eliasasm: “If christians do not hate gays, then why are all the anti-gay hate groups christian? Why is it that christians lead the anti-gay crusade?”

Robert Clifton Robinson: “You have incorrectly labeled people with a term that does not correctly define their motives. Christians love all people and we want them to be saved. We know that the only way to salvation is through Jesus Christ. We know that a life of sin and self only leads to heartache and misery. For these reasons we tell people about Jesus and encourage them to turn from their sins and follow Him. This is not hatred but the epitome of what love does.”

Eliasasm:When did you allow yourself to be indoctrinated and brainwashed?”

Robert Clifton Robinson: “In the 70’s I was a drummer with a touring Rock band. I was becoming increasingly disenchanted with the lifestyle we were leading. Though I had all the success this world seeks, I was not satisfied. I picked up a New Testament one day and began to read in the Gospel of John about the life of Jesus.

I was intrigued by the way Jesus spoke to people and how He lived His life. This began a desire to try and find out who Jesus really is. I began an education in the historical Jesus and all the facts that surrounded His life, death, and resurrection. I found that what is written about Him is true and reliable eyewitness testimony.

I decided to become one of His disciples in 1975 and this new relationship with Him completely changed my life. Now, nearly 45 years later, I have an advanced education in the events of His life and spend my remaining days writing and publishing the facts of all He said and did.

You are right. Coming into a new relationship with Jesus, “washed my mind” of all the filth of this world; the guilt, unfulfillment, and loneliness. Anyone who sincerely turns their life over to Jesus and follows Him with all of their heart, finds satisfaction in this life, and the hope of an everlasting life to come.

Eliasasm:  “So you acknowledge that you allowed yourself to be indoctrinated and brainwashed. If you are so knowledgeable about Jesus, then you should surely know that he was probably gay. The writings in the bible point in that direction. And you should also know that Jesus never spoke of homosexuality and nowhere in the bible does it say that it is a sin.”

Robert Clifton Robinson: “There is no evidence anywhere in the Bible that Jesus was gay. It would have been impossible for anyone who claimed to be the Messiah, to be gay. God forbid men to lie with other men in the Old Testament, and Jesus denounced this practice in the New Testament when He said that from the beginning God created men and women only for each other.

In Genesis 19, it is Jesus, as Yahweh, who comes with the two angels to Sodom and Gomorrah. In Gen. 19:24, it is Jesus as Yahweh, who brings down fire from heaven and destroys all of the inhabitants. Many people don’t know that Jesus did not begin His existence in the NT, He has existed as God forever. We see Him many times in the OT in various places.

The writers of the New Testament understood that Jesus was Yahweh from the Old Testament, and those who translated the Koine-Greek texts, clearly understood that Jesus was Yahweh-God from the Old Testament. Jesus clearly condemned same-sex relationships by His destruction of all the gay men who lived in Sodom and Gomorrah.

There are several scriptures in the NT where the writers described same-sex relationships as sin, equal to fornication, adultery, and all other sins.

Eliasasm: “Yup, you’re brainwashed. How sad. There is nowhere in the bible that says that homosexuality is a sin and that’s simply because there is not one logical or rational reason why it would be. And what’s really sad is that countless of innocent human beings have been and are discriminated against, assaulted and killed because of people, like you, that have been brainwashed into to believing that homosexuality is a sin. If there is evil in this world, it is people like you.

Robert Clifton Robinson: “Of course there are many scriptures which clearly describe same-sex relationships as sin that must be repented of before God will grant eternal life.

The following is an essay I wrote which describes Jesus’ position on same-sex relationships, with the scriptures which reference this view:

What Jesus Said About Same-Sex Relationships

The following is a book I published a few years ago regarding the Biblical stance of same-sex relationships:

“Sodom and Gomorrah: The Gay Marriage and Same-Sex Controversy”

You have taken up the position that being gay is acceptable to God, because you are likely gay. Same-sex sin is no more worse than any other sins, but they must all be ended if a person wants to be forgiven by God and obtain eternal life. This is why Christians tell gay persons about these matters, because we love you and want you all to be saved.”

Eliasasm: “What is it about you “christians” that it is meaningless to you that countless of innocent people are killed because of what you CHOOSE to believe? Beyond appalling.

Robert Clifton Robinson: “Who are these “countless innocent people that are killed,” because we believe in Christ?”

Eliasasm: “WTF is wrong with you???

Let’s count Christian ministers who’ve advocated death for gays

Mr. Ewing says Imam Farrokh Sekaleshfar, an advocate for killing gays, was invited to speak in Orlando. He forgets to mention Christian Pastor Kevin Swanson, who advocates killing gays. (Huckabee, Jindal, and Cruz attended his ‘Freedom 2015′ knowing this.) Or televangelist Ben Bailey of the “Gospel of Christ’ TV program preaching God commands Christians to stone gays and prevent women from teaching. Or Baptist Pastor Roger Jimenez telling his congregation the Orlando massacre was “great” and “helps society.” Or Pastor Donnie Romero of Stedfast Baptist Church agreeing 100 percent with Romero. Romero advocates the death penalty for gays. Or Steven Anderson of Tempe’s Faithful Word Baptist Church applauding the Orlando massacre and calling for the death of all gays. Or Pastor Curtis Knapp of New Hope Baptist Church in Seneca, Kansas, who wants the government to put gays to death. Or Jeff Smith, Emmanuel Baptist Church in Florida who equates homosexuals with serial killers, rapists, and child molesters. Or Pastor and Republican Andy Gipson in Georgia whose Facebook rants include saying gays, according to Leviticus, “are to be put to death.” Or Lake Independent Baptist Church Pastor Dennis Leatherman’s fifty-minute sermon titled ,“Homosexuality and the Bible,” where he describes his struggle not to kill gays. Want more?

Robert Clifton Robinson: “The examples you stated in your response are alleged people who have called for the death of gays. In your original statement you said that “countless people are killed…”

I am not aware of any true Christian leader who calls for the death of gays, or has actually killed a gay person. Your statement is without credibility.

No true Biblical Christian would ever call for the death of any gay person. The persons you listed who allegedly called for the death of gays, do not fit the definition of a true believer in Jesus Christ. Jesus never called for the death of anyone, nor did He ever teach that his disciples should kill anyone.

Certainly you are aware that there are many people who claim to be something that they are not. Jesus described persons who claim to know Him, but in fact, they do not. He said the test of His true followers are people who live their lives as He lived His. Love is the emblem of the true believer.

Many persons have hijacked the name of Christian and used it for their evil purposes. This does not mean they are a Christian, or that all Christians act in this manner. I think you are confused about the difference between people who say they are followers of Jesus, but live evil lives, and persons who are the true followers of Jesus and live righteous lives filled with love.”

Eliasasm: “Certainly you are aware that there are many people who claim to be something that they are not.”

“Many persons have hijacked the name of Christian and used it for their evil purposes.”

Like you. You’re obviously a phony and fraud who writes books to make money off the gullible. Shameful.

Robert Clifton Robinson: “Am I now your enemy because I have told you the truth?

I have never made anything from the books, websites, and essays I write… Jesus said: “freely you have received, freely give…

You accuse me and other Christians of being hateful, but every comment from your mind and heart that I have seen here are filled with hatred. Not a single kind word or appreciation that people care about you and do not want you to be lost.

Search your own heart and see if there is really love there, or are you bitter and filled with hatred? I hope that someday you realize the great love Christ has for you and that you turn from your sins and receive Jesus as your Savior. I would like to see you someday in heaven.”

Eliasasm: “You have not told me any truth. You do not know what truth is. All you have told me is what you have MADE A CHOICE to believe or what you want your gullible readers to believe that is what you believe. That isn’t truth. You’re a fraud and a phony and you just keep proving it. You don’t fool everyone.”

Robert Clifton Robinson: “The only truth that exists in this world is what God has said. The Bible is the source of God’s truth, and every word that He said is the truth. Jesus said the He is the way, the truth, and the life, and no one comes to the Father except through Him.

Your truth is based upon how you feel, and what you think will make you happy. There is a way that seems right to a man, but it only leads to death, and separation from God.

You want God to accept you as you are, and in the lifestyle you have chosen, but He has said that He will not accept any of us if we are not willing to first turn from our sins and then receive Christ as our Savior.

You say that being gay is not a sin, God said that it is. Until you agree with God and do what He said, there is no hope of salvation. This is the truth that I have declared to you, but you are not willing to come to Christ, turn from your sins and be saved. In the end. it will be what you do in this present situation that will determine where your life ends up.

I pray that you come to a knowledge of the truth and do what you should. I sincerely care about you and the reason I have taken this time with you is because I care. There is no other reason for me to do this, other than love that I have for you, even though I have never met you or know much about you. The love of Christ constrains me…

Eliasasm: “Show me a quote where your god specifically said that homosexuality is a sin.”

Robert Clifton Robinson: “The New Testament describes Jesus as “The Word of God,” the Logos (John 1:1). This designation for Jesus means that He is the true author of all the text in the Bible.

The pre-incarnate Jesus appears many times in the Old Testament, Genesis 16:7, Genesis 22:10-12, Exodus 3:2.

The New Testament Koine-Greek is clear that Jesus is Yahweh-God from the Old Testament who created all laws (Luke 2:11).

Therefore, all of the Old Testament Laws regarding sexual behavior, Jesus is the author of these laws.

Jesus wrote in Leviticus 18:22, a man shall not have sex with another man.

Jesus later said that “not one jot or tittle of the law will be done away (Matthew 5:18). The Old Testament laws that prohibit a man from lying with another man are still in effect today.

It was the “Lord” Jesus (Yahweh) in Genesis 19:24 who destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah for their sexual sin: “Then the Lord-Yahweh rained brimstone and fire on Sodom and Gomorrah.”

Jude 1:7 confirms that the sin of Sodom and Gomorrah was sex between men, describing their acts as, “filled with immorality and every kind of sexual perversion.”

Jude confirms that it was the pre-incarnate Jesus that destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah (Jude 1:5-7 NLT).

Jesus describes the sexual practices of the men in Sodom as “wicked,” in Matthew 11:23.

2 Peter 2:6-10, Peter also confirms that Sodom and Gomorrah are an example of those who indulge in same-sex acts as “perversion, shameful immorality, and wickedness, resulting in their destruction by the Lord.”

In the New Testament all of the laws regarding sexual behavior continue. 1 Corinthians 6:9-10, and Galatians 5:19-21 describing persons who practice same-sex as not going to heaven.

Paul describes same-sex acts in Romans chapter 1:24-29 as “shameful, men with men and women with women, against the natural way to have sex, and resulting in a penalty within themselves.”

In Acts 15:28-29, the Apostles determined that all of the sexual laws from the Old Testament are still in effect today.

Jesus said that “God created male and female from the beginning,” and the male joins himself to the female (Mark 10:6). These two become one, not two men or two women.

Paul confirmed the words of Jesus in Ephesian 5:31-32, stating that one man and one woman are an example of the unity that God intends for His creation. The relationship of two men or two women cannot achieve this union that God intended.

Jesus told the woman who was caught in the act of adultery to, “go and sin no more.” Sexual sin must not be continued.

Jesus was Himself, without sin. Jesus never committed sexual sin (Hebrews 4:15, 1 Peter 1:19).

Jesus said that unless we all repent from our sins, we will all be lost (Luke 13:3-5).

Jesus stated that all the “sexually immoral” are outside the gates of heaven (Revelation 22:16).

A person who remains in a same-sex relationship cannot be rightly defined as a “Christian,” because this designation demands repentance from the sin of same-sex relationships before salvation is granted Romans 6:1).”

Eliasasm:  “I don’t see anything there saying that homosexuality is a sin. Sodom and Gomorrah was about rape, not homosexuality. And again, the bible is not anti-LGBT and that’s simply because there is not one logical or rational reason why it would be and you can not come up with one. Even the Pope says that christians need to apologize to the LGBTQ community. And again, you are a fraud and a phony. Know why I know this? Because you claim that christians are not christians if they don’t think just like you. You’re sadly pathetic and mistaken. And what makes you more pathetic is you refuse to acknowledge the serious harm YOUR christianity has done to the LGBTQ community. That is a fact whether you acknowledge it or not. What’s even more pathetic about it is that the LGBTQs that have been harmed by YOUR christianity are not even christians, which means they are none of your fucking business, yet they are paying the price. There is nothing Christ like about anyone like you.

Robert Clifton Robinson: “The sin of Sodom was rape?

Certainly you are aware that the modern and ancient definition of Sodomy, is anal copulation. It is not rape!

Is it not clear to you the original commandment of God? Leviticus 18:22 (NKJV) 22 You shall not lie with a male as with a woman. It is an abomination.

“Abomination” is defined as: atrocity, disgrace, horror, obscenity, outrage, evil, crime, monstrosity, anathema, bane.

Is it hard for you to comprehend the words, “immorality and sexual perversion,” in defining same-sex acts?

Jude 1:7 confirms that the sin of Sodom and Gomorrah was sex between men, describing their acts as, “filled with immorality and every kind of sexual perversion.”

Can you not understand the word Peter wrote regarding sodomy: 2 Peter 2:6-10, Peter also confirms that Sodom and Gomorrah are an example of those who indulge in same-sex acts as “perversion, shameful immorality, and wickedness, resulting in their destruction by the Lord.”

Is Paul’s clarification of same-sex relationships not comprehensible to you?

Paul describes same-sex acts in Romans chapter 1:24-29 as “shameful, men with men and women with women, against the natural way to have sex, and resulting in a penalty within themselves.”

The Bible makes these things clear and there is not ambiguity as to their meaning. What is also clear is your confusion over what God requires, and what He has declared in the Bible. He stated these things, not because He hates you, but because He loves you and wants you to turn from this lifestyle and be saved.

You seek to justify your chosen life as a gay person, and reject what God said and those who lovingly try to reason with you. It is sad that you cannot be reached at this point, but I will continue to pray that your heart softens and becomes open to hear God and turn from this life and do what God requires. I want you to be saved, and this is why I try to reason with you.

Robert Clifton Robinson: “The question we must ask ourselves is why God prohibits the relationships of same-sex couples? We might imagine that it is because God doesn’t want us to really enjoy our lives, and some people like to be in a relationship with a person of the same-sex.

This was not the reason God prohibited same-sex relationships. He does want us to thoroughly enjoy our lives, to their fullest potential. Jesus said that He came “to give us life, and life more abundantly.” God knows that same-sex relationships will not give us the true happiness He intended. He knows that in the end these relationships bring heartache and misery for those who live in this manner.

God created men for women and women for men, because in this loving, God-centered relationship, a man and woman will find true and lasting happiness. When we take what God made and use it for something He did not intend, we harm ourselves and malign the goodness and nature of God.

In simpler terms: imagine that I sculpt a beautiful figure for you that takes me decades to create. I give it to you as an act of love to enjoy and enhance your life. One day you decide that this sculpture would be good for breaking large rocks into smaller rocks for your pathway. After using the beautiful statue for several weeks to bash stones, it is scarred and damaged and no longer resembles the beautiful art I first gave you. Our lives are like this sculpture that God has given us. He wants us to enjoy it, but to use it in the manner He designed it for. When we use our bodies in ways that God did not intend, they become scarred and damaged and no longer resemble the beauty He intended for us.

God gave all of His commands for our benefit, so that we might experience the fullness of all His goodness and love. We obey Him because we believe He is good and does loves us, and by doing what He said, we will be the beneficiaries of a wonderful life.”

I did not hear back from this young man again.



Categories: Christians Endorsing Gay Marriage, Defending the Gospel, Following Jesus, Gay marriage, Gender Identity, Jesus Church, Living For Jesus, Robert Clifton Robinson, Same-Sex and Saved, Speaking out against sin, The Condition of the Heart, The gay lifestyle, True Repentance

Tags: , ,

Make a comment or argument.

Fill in your details below or click an icon to log in:

WordPress.com Logo

You are commenting using your WordPress.com account. Log Out /  Change )

Google photo

You are commenting using your Google account. Log Out /  Change )

Twitter picture

You are commenting using your Twitter account. Log Out /  Change )

Facebook photo

You are commenting using your Facebook account. Log Out /  Change )

Connecting to %s

This site uses Akismet to reduce spam. Learn how your comment data is processed.